Today's ITT tour (Mt. Minobu/Shiraito Waterfall) left from Yokosuka at 0430 and returned at 2200.  On this one specific bus (there were two), was one baby that could not stop crying every other 20-30 minutes.  There's a few problems with this:

1) The baby obviously was unhappy with his/her surroundings.
2) Most of all the obnoxious noise was made within a 20 square meter confined bus.
3) Not a single apology was issued for subjecting everyone to the hourS worth (cumulative) of disturbance.

As a parent/parents, shame on you for all the above.  I'm glad that you had a chance for a family outing, but it was at the expense of everyone else's comfort AND your own child's comfort.  Having a child inherently means that you will have to sacrifice some part of your life (time, money, social, etc), but why punish both your child and other bystanders?  Obviously your baby is screaming its head off because it's not happy.  Why would you (1) subject them to this, (2) decide to "test" them out on one of the longest tours that ITT offers?  It's selfish no matter which way you slice it.  Even if you had "tested" them out on a shorter tour, it still would have been a huge imposition on everyone else on the tour.

Before anyone asks, I do not hate children.  In fact I love them very much.  

Terrible parents/parenting-that is what I hate.  You had a kid.  You're going to sacrifice some things that you'd like to do.  Put up with it.  Don't make your child and 28 others have to deal with your selfishness.  

Another option is to simply drive there at a reasonable hour and return when you want.  It's a nice drive and you can park at the entrance or across the street for a little less.  Just plug the coordinates into your gps and go.  That also gives you the freedom to explore some of the other areas as well.

Shiraito Falls N35.18.829' E138.35.299'

I've found that traveling with my small children has been pretty smooth, but in no way are you owed an apology. That's downright arrogant.
Whenever you subject yourself to public tours/travel in confined spaces all you can do is rant afterwards I guess. I've been stuck with sick people coughing up lungs, etc. Babies cry. Next time drive yourself.

Posted By Jallen on 04-01-2012 11:30 PM
I've found that traveling with my small children has been pretty smooth, but in no way are you owed an apology. That's downright arrogant.
Whenever you subject yourself to public tours/travel in confined spaces all you can do is rant afterwards I guess. I've been stuck with sick people coughing up lungs, etc. Babies cry. Next time drive yourself.

What she said exactly!  And to suggest that a child crying indicates terrible parenting is offensive!! Babies cry.  Sometimes we can anticipate it and handle it quickly, sometimes it's something that comes out of the blue.  I'm sure the parents were doing their vary best and were unhappy with the situation as well.  Oh, and children are extremely sensitive and aware of the emotions and attitudes of those around them--they can actually read peoples faces and emotions better than any adult. It's possible that your facial expressions, attitude and behavior all contributed to the continued crying of the baby.

Haha...what he said....(Proud PaPa!)     

Posted By OKKiddo on 04-02-2012 12:32 AM

Posted By Jallen on 04-01-2012 11:30 PM
I've found that traveling with my small children has been pretty smooth, but in no way are you owed an apology. That's downright arrogant.
Whenever you subject yourself to public tours/travel in confined spaces all you can do is rant afterwards I guess. I've been stuck with sick people coughing up lungs, etc. Babies cry. Next time drive yourself.

What she said exactly!  And to suggest that a child crying indicates terrible parenting is offensive!! Babies cry.  Sometimes we can anticipate it and handle it quickly, sometimes it's something that comes out of the blue.  I'm sure the parents were doing their vary best and were unhappy with the situation as well.  Oh, and children are extremely sensitive and aware of the emotions and attitudes of those around them--they can actually read peoples faces and emotions better than any adult. It's possible that your facial expressions, attitude and behavior all contributed to the continued crying of the baby.

I agree with all of the above!  Sometimes it's difficult to find a babysitter for an all day outing such as this trip.  Having children does not have to mean that you can't go anywhere, it means you take your baby with you.  A crying baby may have irritated you, but I bet those parents were more upset by the crying.  For me, I get so embarrassed when I cannot calm my little girl.  Sometimes there just anything you can do but let them cry.  You can bet your last dollar that I would not be apologizing to you for my child, that's what young children and babies do.  They have no other way to express themselves.  Get over yourself and drive yourself next time.

The baby could have been feeling motion sick, was hot, bored....etc. I wouldn't blame a parent for having a crying baby on a plane or bus, those things just happen. You can't always stop it, and it doesn't make you less of a parent if your efforts aren't soothing a crying BABY. Now, if your KIDS are running willy nilly around the bus, hitting people with rolled up pieces of paper, or throwing food (like my last bus tour), and you do nothing, then I get a little pissed and think you may be a terrible parent.


Edit:     Crying every 20-30 minutes? How long was the bus ride? Doesn't seem that bad to me. Also, babies don't really do much other than cry, eat, sleep, and soil diapers. 

Another parent giving my 2 yen's worth. We have always gone out of our way to make sure our young children are comfortable in their surroundings, and are not making other people uncomfortable as well. We have taken our children out of stores in the middle of shopping, had one of us take them to the car while the other parent got our food to go, paid, and left in restaurants, left movies, etc. because our young children were upset and/or unhappy and we felt it was wrong to subject others who were trying to enjoy themselves to the crying and because it would stress us out knowing our child was so upset and so was everyone around us. I'm sure our kids could feel our stress (I doubt they paid any attention to onlookers) and it ramped them up. Whatever the source of the crying was (tired, mad, etc.) our kids know that if they don't behave, we will leave. You can't get off of a tour bus because a baby is crying, but I wouldn't put myself, my baby, or the general public through all of that just for my own purposes, knowing that all of my kids cried in cars. If someone knows their child cries in a situation like that, it is inconsiderate to the child and to the other passengers to take the baby on the bus.

And if we are in a situation (such as on a plane) where my child is inconsolable, I do apologize to the other passengers for disturbing their peace. I have found people to be much more sympathetic when I acknowledge that it is unpleasant for everyone around to listen to a crying child and see me trying to comfort the baby. I always figure that people who are parents have been in a similar situation and people who are not parents yet might put it off for a few years after seeing what traveling with a kid is like.

Okay, after my big rant, I wanted to add that I had colicky babies that were known criers, but babies are unpredictable and sometimes even mild-mannered babies have an off day, which would be a big shock to the parents and once you're on the bus, it's too late to turn back at that point.

Thank you geewhiz, that's being considerate parents!

The baby might have been having an "off" day...usually exceptionally good, but for some reason had a day.... I do understand selfish parents...making their kids go to a resturant at 9pm even though kid is obviously fussy and tired ....that is selfish, and different from this situation. I would follow Yokotas advise and just go on your own or meet the group...being on a bus like that, you are bound to run into issues that you wont like.

Taking a tour is not like flying. You are flying to get somewhere, and families often don't have any viable alternative. Taking a tour is a recreational choice. In essence, it IS the activity; it's not simply a mode of transportation.

All told, I am sympathetic & mostly in agreement with the OP. How can a family possibly think that a 16-hour tour will in any way be fun for a child? Particularly, as one person already said, you have the alternative to drive. Which, of course, allows you to stop whenever you want, give the kid some variety, and avoids subjecting strangers to the bad choices you made.

You can walk out of a store, theater, or restaurant if your kid is stressed, but you can't step off a tour bus. The parents took a calculated risk that somehow this would all work out -- surely they must have weighed the pro's and the cons -- and they lost the bet. The odds were stacked against them all along.

I'm a parent & an uncle with plenty of exposure to growing kids. What I have found, almost without exception, is that once kids get tired, miss their nap, disrupt their sleep pattern, they WILL become moody, cranky & inconsolable. It is completely predictable. You can see it just after lunch at any public event where the kid didn't get a nap, they get cranky. What do you expect, then, rousting a kid out of bed at 4:00 AM, pack them in a bus with lots of strangers, hiking around for the day, and a long ride home. This WAS selfish on the part of the parents -- inconsiderate to their child and to the people they imposed upon.

One poster said: "Having children does not have to mean that you can't go anywhere." True, but your choices become much more limited. You just have to say no to some activities because they don't make sense.

Posted By navywife86 on 04-02-2012 4:38 AM

Posted By OKKiddo on 04-02-2012 12:32 AM

Posted By Jallen on 04-01-2012 11:30 PM
I've found that traveling with my small children has been pretty smooth, but in no way are you owed an apology. That's downright arrogant.
Whenever you subject yourself to public tours/travel in confined spaces all you can do is rant afterwards I guess. I've been stuck with sick people coughing up lungs, etc. Babies cry. Next time drive yourself.

What she said exactly!  And to suggest that a child crying indicates terrible parenting is offensive!! Babies cry.  Sometimes we can anticipate it and handle it quickly, sometimes it's something that comes out of the blue.  I'm sure the parents were doing their vary best and were unhappy with the situation as well.  Oh, and children are extremely sensitive and aware of the emotions and attitudes of those around them--they can actually read peoples faces and emotions better than any adult. It's possible that your facial expressions, attitude and behavior all contributed to the continued crying of the baby.

I agree with all of the above!  Sometimes it's difficult to find a babysitter for an all day outing such as this trip.  Having children does not have to mean that you can't go anywhere, it means you take your baby with you.  A crying baby may have irritated you, but I bet those parents were more upset by the crying.  For me, I get so embarrassed when I cannot calm my little girl.  Sometimes there just anything you can do but let them cry.  You can bet your last dollar that I would not be apologizing to you for my child, that's what young children and babies do.  They have no other way to express themselves.  Get over yourself and drive yourself next time.

All of this.

I agree with ThaiGuy. My son is much older now but I woul dhave never subjected him (or myself) to a crazy ITT tour like that. There are sacrifices you have to make as a parent and that may mena missing a few trips. The least this parent could have done is apologize. Many parents get used to the crying and tune out their kids. sorry the bus ride was unplesant. Hope you enjoyed the rest of the day.

The should be glad they were not on a plane - parents get booted off flights all the time for crying babies that disrupt everyone else.

I don’t think there is anything arrogant about thinking an apology should be in order if one’s child was disrupting an entire group of people! I have 4 kids and know I would feel terrible if I put others through that. I will never understand the attitude of “I will take my kids anywhere I want, regardless of how it affects those around me.” The sense of entitlement shown by many parents slays me.

This thread really angered me.
Who are you judge a parent and their skills?
It is judging people like you, why I stay at home all the time, and skip the events. My son is amazing, barely cries, really eager to be near people. But if he were to cry on a bus, I would NOT apologize. I would be spending my time making him feel better.

I am now aware that I will be having to skip all the amazing tours, on the grounds I wish to not be judged.
Thank you for opening my eyes.

Can anyone explain why it is so hard, bad, wrong, etc., to simply say "I am sorry if my child bothered you" when you know they did?

Posted By Groovie on 04-02-2012 9:56 AM
Can anyone explain why it is so hard, bad, wrong, etc., to simply say "I am sorry if my child bothered you" when you know they did?

There is nothing wrong with saying this once or twice.
But saying this EVERYTIME a baby cries is extreme. And OP clearly wouldn't have even accepted the lady saying this.
Poor woman must have been devistated the baby was acting out on the bus.

I must be missing something. She didn’t say she expected multiple apologies, she said not a single one was made.
I really don’t know what person in their right mind would think taking a baby on a tour of this length would be a good idea. I wouldn’t have ever considered it and none of my kids cried typically.

I also don’t get the “I just won’t go anywhere because of my kids…….” No one said that, a little common sense, etc., goes a long way. We lived in Japan when my kids were little…in fact all four were either toddlers or babies when we lived here. I went on plenty of tours, met the ship in ports, and took them to many places in Japan. It can be done without forcing your child or those around you into an uncomfortable situation. Just takes a little extra work and imagination.

Groovie, OP stated that she didn't like bad parenting, which was her trying to be subtle saying the lady with the child was a bad parent because he child was crying. Do you agree with that?

I am simply saying, I now feel that if I were to finally go on a tour with my 9 month old son, I would be stepping on egg shells with people who would judge me. I am a young mother anyway, my son rarely cries in public. He doesn't like sitting in his car seat for long periods of time, so being a bus would be weird for him. Now for me, I either miss the trips as I am doing now, to make my son happy, or I take him with me, he cries and people post silly little rants about bad parenting.

OP could have used much calmer words and less harsh phrases. This is all I am getting at.

I wont be commenting on this thread anymore. I have given my 2 cents on this.

I think you are reading way more into what she wrote than what she actually said.
I will add…babysitters are wonderful things! You can do things and go places that may not be a good situation for your child, while your child can remain in a comfortable environment.

In agreement to everything that ThaiGuy mentioned, I'd like to add that I haven't been to a movie theater since my 2 children were born, the youngest being 2 now.  It was a choice I made.  We got around it with Drive-in theaters, but that's not available to us anymore.  It's a conscious choice me and my wife have made to keep our children comfortable and not to disturb others.  The movie theater is just one example.  We have limited our choices BY CHOICE.  I'm sure our kids appreciate it, and for those who enjoyed their time out without fussy kids around, You're welcome. 

I can't really agree with either side, I feel like I'm taking both. If it's a mode of transportation it can't be helped. Not everyone has a car. A tour, yes I'd be a little peeved, but I personally choose not to go on ITT tours for those people with kids they refuse to/can't control/handle. I don't go to movie theaters (unless I have to) because I hate talkers. Last time I went some lady brought her damn barking mini dog and a crying baby. I personally haven't had a night out in the first 5 years of my daughters life because she needed those quiet nap/snack times. She is a well behaved kid, but when she got tired she got emotional. At 6, I can say that she can behave in public, let us know if she needs a rest, snack....etc without disturbing the peace.

On one hand, I think about the parents who are transitioning here, and how in AOB they tell you to take a tour, get out, don't get depressed. I really don't know their situation, and can't really say that particular parent doesn't deserve to be selfish once in a while for the sake of his/her sanity. But then again, if you're going to be selfish in such a way, at least issue a few apologies. Take extra steps to make sure your child wont be such a disturbance to others. Pack extra binkies, bottles, carry a roller suitcase full of stuff if you have to. Toys, blankets, snacks, books.... If your baby really is that inconsolable, then yes, I'd have to agree with those people that suggest traveling by car (rental or not) or not going at all. It really isn't fair to those people who paid just as much money as you did, and not to enjoy themselves to the fullest.

You guys are making me fear that Japan is really unfriendly. Maybe they were new to the station and didn't have a way of getting around on their own yet (No license) and needed to get out of lodging. Maybe the baby was breastfed (so no bottles!) and won't take a binky. Maybe it's a BABY and not interested in toys yet--go ahead lug a whole suitcase around for show. BABIES CRY! You can do everything in your power to prevent it, be the gentlest most observant, reactive parent possible and a baby will still eventually cry. Your suggestion is to then leave the baby with a babysitter? If they've just gotten here that's cruel--it's a scary new place and the only constant is Mom and Dad! And if the baby doesn't take a bottle and only the breast then it's not possible. Welcome to the world of natural parenting, where you alone are responsible for your child's emotional and physical health.

My husband and I went to San Francisco a couple of times with our son when he was under a year old. It's not a town you drive around in! You take public transit everywhere. We also signed up for a bus tour of the city, knowing full well we couldn't get ourselves around to all of the locations we wanted to see using only public transit in one day. You'd spend most of your time waiting at a corner! We went on the tour with a baby carrier, a stroller, baby food/snacks, and the two toys that he liked. He cried once or twice when he was tired and one of those times was for around 10 minutes because he was tired but was too wired to fall asleep. I was hyperaware of those around me but no one was so judgemental and unwelcoming as the OP! In fact, everyone was very, very supportive. Our bus tour took the entire day, we were all exhausted but would do it again in a heartbeat because we learned so much about San Fran!

And as far as booting parents off of planes because of a child crying?! What is the world coming too when we can't tolerate the noise of a baby?! If we can't stand to be around what we procreate to the point that we callously toss them from modes of transportation?! Of course they're going to cry! It's a bustling airport full of stress and people poking and prodding and rushing. Strangers are touching children and stripping them down, separating them from their parents and the parents comforting touch, loud obnoxious strangers are talking and shoving, things are slamming and metal is screeching, electronics are beeping, and a loudspeaker is so loud it actually hurts the sensitive hearing of younger children. Parents are stressed and rushed, then long waits ensue and not enough to keep the child entertained because of luggage/space limitations. Lets put some of you adults in a rat race maze where the external stimuli is more like an electric shock to your nervous system so that you can gain some empathy and insight!

Posted By Jallen on 04-02-2012 1:21 AM
Haha...what he said....(Proud PaPa!)     

Sorry, what HE said then!  Glad to see a COMPASSIONATE male response!

ALL i can say is i hope i get on the ITT bus with you and let my kids scream the whole way. Obviously you are not a mother so you wouldn't understand. As for limiting myself on tours because of kids? NO my kids and I deserve to be on those tours as well as you. Why doesn't anyone complain about the snotty ladies who are bitter about kids that won't shut up on the bus talking about ALL the things they get to do because they don't have to lug a kid around? Now that is rude. Yes I had to deal with that all the way to Tokyo Disney of all places. Maybe they should take the train or drive themselves since its sooo much easier to get around when no children are involved. Having children is a blessing.

Posted By BekiG on 04-02-2012 10:37 AM
OP stated that she didn't like bad parenting, which was her trying to be subtle saying the lady with the child was a bad parent because he child was crying. Do you agree with that?

Absolutely not!  A child crying is not a sign of bad parenting, but bringing a child into an inappropriate situation IS.  You can bring your kid to R-rated movies if you want -- parents do, and it's their legal right.  But it's bad for the kid, it's inappropriate, and I have told parents that before.

Yes, you can bring your infant on a 17-hour bus tour if you want.  I won't say it's harmful to your child, but neither is it especially good for them.  They won't enjoy it, it's a nuisance to others around you, it's basically selfish.  THAT is bad parenting, yet it is absolutely your right to do so if you should so desire.  The others who are impacted can't prevent you, but they likewise can exercise their right to make their unhappiness known. 

I seriously doubt this was a family who has been in Yokosuka only a couple of weeks (as another poster surmised).  That would be the epitome of recklessness, cuz now you also have a jetlagged kid who doesn't even know if it's day or night.  In the end, it comes down making deliberate choices, the overriding one which must be -- is this in my child's best interest?  And secondarily, am I making an ass of myself?  Not everyone is cognizant enough to ask or honestly answer these two questions.

Maybe they were new to the station and didn't have a way of getting around on their own yet (No license) and needed to get out of lodging.

That’s probably it. Japan is so limited on other forms of transportation there are no other options to get out of Lodging except taking a baby on a 17.5 tour.

ALL i can say is i hope i get on the ITT bus with you and let my kids scream the whole way. Obviously you are not a mother so you wouldn't understand.

What is obvious about her not being a mother? I don’t know if she is or not, but I am…and would be less than thrilled if I were on that tour also.

My husband and I went to San Francisco a couple of times with our son when he was under a year old. It's not a town you drive around in! You take public transit everywhere. We also signed up for a bus tour of the city, knowing full well we couldn't get ourselves around to all of the locations we wanted to see using only public transit in one day.

There is nothing wrong with taking public transportation, and it's fairly easy but it’s not that difficult to drive around San Fran. I used to do it several times a month. In all the times we went we only took the trolley one time from our hotel to Fisherman’s Warf.

Im saying learn to deal with it or just don't go. People need to understand there is a lot of (temp) single mothers out there that cant drive long distance by herself, and a stroller on a train? really? its a hazard. They do need to get out every once in a while and if ITT is there only option so be it.

If she were a mother she wouldn't be complaining because every mother or father has been through that at one point unless your child is perfect. Im sure the kid wasn't crying the whole way. It is bad judgement to say there was bad parenting because I bet on the inside that parent was dying of embarrassment and there is only so much you can do to calm your kid.

There is always going to be a battle when it comes to children in public places. Either you can stand it or not. If its that much of a problem take it up with the ITT. Im done.

As someone who is going to be becoming a parent any day now (latest by the end of the week) I would pray that no one in their right mind would think that getting a kid up at 4 am for a 17.5 hour tour would be a good idea. I can completely understand the need to get out and explore, especially here in Japan, and using ITT is great. However, they have enough tours and what not that are shorter, and probably more small child friendly, that it shouldn't be that hard to find something. Maybe that longer tour should have waited to be a two person adventure, on a weekend where you could find a sitter, or until the child is a bit older? I remember being really young, and the long car trips that my parents would take my sister and I on, and I know that I wouldn't have appreciated being put through that type of tour, even as much as I like doing that exact thing now.

Thank you, Evan. Very common-sense. :-)

Posted By ThaiGuy on 04-02-2012 3:25 PM

Posted By BekiG on 04-02-2012 10:37 AM
OP stated that she didn't like bad parenting, which was her trying to be subtle saying the lady with the child was a bad parent because he child was crying. Do you agree with that?

Absolutely not!  A child crying is not a sign of bad parenting, but bringing a child into an inappropriate situation IS.  You can bring your kid to R-rated movies if you want -- parents do, and it's their legal right.  But it's bad for the kid, it's inappropriate, and I have told parents that before.

Yes, you can bring your infant on a 17-hour bus tour if you want.  I won't say it's harmful to your child, but neither is it especially good for them.  They won't enjoy it, it's a nuisance to others around you, it's basically selfish.  THAT is bad parenting, yet it is absolutely your right to do so if you should so desire.  The others who are impacted can't prevent you, but they likewise can exercise their right to make their unhappiness known. 

I seriously doubt this was a family who has been in Yokosuka only a couple of weeks (as another poster surmised).  That would be the epitome of recklessness, cuz now you also have a jetlagged kid who doesn't even know if it's day or night.  In the end, it comes down making deliberate choices, the overriding one which must be -- is this in my child's best interest?  And secondarily, am I making an ass of myself?  Not everyone is cognizant enough to ask or honestly answer these two questions.

I would have to completely agree with you on this one. I think there are a few posts that go a bit overboard with the opinions. I had no idea the tour was a 17.5 hour long thing. Why would you bring a baby to such a long tour, knowing how long the ride is going to be, the noise level...etc. We're talking baby, an infant, not a child. It really isn't fair to those who went to enjoy themselves. Yes, everyone does deserve to enjoy themselves, be a little selfish.... Im sure nobody here would like it if they were stuck on a bus trip for 17.5 hours with a screaming baby. Maybe not start a thread about it, but maybe their opinions would change. 

Posted By RoboCat on 04-02-2012 5:36 PM

Posted By ThaiGuy on 04-02-2012 3:25 PM

Posted By BekiG on 04-02-2012 10:37 AM
OP stated that she didn't like bad parenting, which was her trying to be subtle saying the lady with the child was a bad parent because he child was crying. Do you agree with that?

Absolutely not!  A child crying is not a sign of bad parenting, but bringing a child into an inappropriate situation IS.  You can bring your kid to R-rated movies if you want -- parents do, and it's their legal right.  But it's bad for the kid, it's inappropriate, and I have told parents that before.

Yes, you can bring your infant on a 17-hour bus tour if you want.  I won't say it's harmful to your child, but neither is it especially good for them.  They won't enjoy it, it's a nuisance to others around you, it's basically selfish.  THAT is bad parenting, yet it is absolutely your right to do so if you should so desire.  The others who are impacted can't prevent you, but they likewise can exercise their right to make their unhappiness known. 

I seriously doubt this was a family who has been in Yokosuka only a couple of weeks (as another poster surmised).  That would be the epitome of recklessness, cuz now you also have a jetlagged kid who doesn't even know if it's day or night.  In the end, it comes down making deliberate choices, the overriding one which must be -- is this in my child's best interest?  And secondarily, am I making an ass of myself?  Not everyone is cognizant enough to ask or honestly answer these two questions.

I would have to completely agree with you on this one. I think there are a few posts that go a bit overboard with the opinions. I had no idea the tour was a 17.5 hour long thing. Why would you bring a baby to such a long tour, knowing how long the ride is going to be, the noise level...etc. We're talking baby, an infant, not a child. It really isn't fair to those who went to enjoy themselves. Yes, everyone does deserve to enjoy themselves, be a little selfish.... Im sure nobody here would like it if they were stuck on a bus trip for 17.5 hours with a screaming baby. Maybe not start a thread about it, but maybe their opinions would change.

I agree that a 17.5 hour tour is too long.  It would be too long for ME with 3,4, or 5 year old children and no infants.  But, I really rankle at what you guys are determining to be bad parenting.  Your description of bad parenting basically says because I took my son on a bus tour of San Francisco all day as an infant makes me a bad parent.  How could making sure that I was close by and that his every need was taken care of make me a bad parent?!

I really feel that this thread started in a judgmental fashion, has continued in one with a very obnoxious view of an "I'm better than you" mentality.  And that is all that I have to say on the subject for those who are holier than thou.

Let me share my experience..

When Julia our daughter was young, about 3 months, we decided to use the transport bus from Narita airport back to Yokosuka.

This was our first time, using this transit bus. The bus was PACKED! We were sitting near the front.

Well, we all know the bus is about 2 hours.

Well she probably cried for literally 2 hours! THE ENTIRE TIME! I felt SOOOO BAD!

I did apologize to people, especially those sitting next to me. When she screams, SHE SCREAMS! I can still feel bad when I think about it, because I remember seeing everyone's faces, LIKE SHUT YOUR DAMN KID UP!

But they saw I was trying, even standing at times in the middle of the bus trying to hold her. Nothing was working. We tried feeding her, Yuko tried breastfeeding on the bus... Nothing seemed to work.

I agree, sometimes babies just want to be cranky.

Was it our fault? I dont know if I would say that. But I did learn from this experience, and I will tell you that we have never used PUBLIC TRANSPORTATION again.

The next time we had to go to the airport, we drove. I wont use the bus anymore, simply because I worry about how others may feel, and I am not going to put them through her loud screaming, if she wanted to act the same way again.

Granted now she is 16 months old, and I think she is a lot better, and older, to understand things, but still I wont take the chance.

So for the above posters, some I feel agreed with the original poster, and some disagreed.

I see her side of it, and for someone that was a parent with that screaming kid, I learned from my mistake.

I must have missed the part where it was a ridiculously long trip.... so, I would have to say, maybe not the best idea to bring a small child on a trip that long. I am a mother to a small child, and I would not do that with her. I have a very happy daughter, who hardly fusses, but I also know how embarrassed I do get when she does it in public. That being said, I still stand by my opinion that this should in no way reflect upon the parent's pareting. Sure, an apology would have been appropriate, but at the same time, I'm not sure if the OP would have really cared... not for me to decide.

I also know that I just made a CRAZY trip from the states with my 15 month old. We were supposed to arrive Tuesday evening, only to be unable to land and get re-routed through Osaka for the night. My daughter held up remarkable well, but there were times that she cried. I cannot believe that people get kicked off the plane for infants crying.... I have never witnessed this and that's just absurd. Sometimes a child crying is out of a parent's hands, no matter how hard they try to console their child. I just feel like it's really presumptuous of the OP (and others on here) to make judgments about parenting and say what they should or should not have done. I agree that people with children have made that choice, and therefore limited some options, but I do not feel like that means they should have to shut themselves up at home 24/7 to avoid irritating the rest of the world. That person could have chosen a shorter trip, sure, but maybe it was somewhere they really wanted to go. And as far as a babysitter goes.... I know that for me, it's been near impossible to find a babysitter for my daughter (who really is a sweet girl and almost always happy), let alone a babysitter for an ENTIRE DAY.

All I know is that I am not going to pay however much yen a day for parking at the airport when I can take the Narita bus for free. Sorry if you don't like my screaming kids. People can take thier own cars if they don't like it.

Posted By felinious on 04-05-2012 6:07 PM
All I know is that I am not going to pay however much yen a day for parking at the airport when I can take the Narita bus for free. Sorry if you don't like my screaming kids. People can take thier own cars if they don't like it.

Not that I'm judge & jury, but in my mind there is a big difference between bringing a child on a 17-hour tour vs bringing them on the bus to the airport. Or even on the plane.  In the one case, the bus itself IS the recreation.  In the other case, it's simply the transport to get you to your destination.  I don't begrudge families trying to get from Point A to Point B even with crying kids; I have a degree of sympathy. But bringing them on a crazy long day-trip, I have little to no sympathy.

You shouldn't feel at all apologetic about bringing your kids on the Narita shuttle.

I wouldv'e been annoyed had I been stuck on a bus with a crying infant. Children should be allowed with their parents on ITT tours, but when the tours are that long...there should be a line drawn. As far as the apologizing for a crying baby, that's a little much..babies do cry, but as a person who doesn't want children...I would have been annoyed too.

I missed the 17.5 hours part, but OP clearly said "bad parenting"...I will not sit back and watch somebody be so judgmental.
Yes 17.5 hours is LONG for an infant, heck it is for me too, but at the end of the day, most of us will be in Japan THREE years, it may be rough but doing these tours will be an experience. I wouldn't travel that long personally, but I have already bumped into a few judgemental people, who can't keep their opinions to themselves, so this pushed me over the edge.

Good luck for everybody going on tours, I hope one day I can find a way to tour myself.

FWIW, I've been in Japan 3 years this time around and 4 years previously. I have NEVER been on an ITT tour, other than once to climb Mt Fuji as I knew I'd be too beat to drive home afterwards.

My wife & I find it MUCH more enjoyable to just drive on our own. Learning our way around, taking side trips along the way, stopping for ramen on a whim, taking a 17-hour tour & turning it into an overnighter with a funky Japanese hotel -- these have been among our greatest pleasures in Japan. We not only have been to most places that ITT goes, but also to many others that our friends have never even heard of.

This keeps us from having to wake up at 4 AM, or conform to anyone's schedule but our own. It's usually pretty affordable with rental cars, or by avoiding the tollroad, and by using budget business hotels.

I just wondered if you or anyone else offered to help them?
Im sure the parents were embarassed and stressed out.

It honestly depends on the child.

I'm an Air Force Brat born and raised with four younger siblings. Our parents took us everywhere and we were always well behaved.
Even now, my wife and I have a six month old son who's been going with us on various tours around Sasebo. The only time he fusses is when he's hungry, and that's easily remedied. As to the others on the bus? Most of them actually live in our housing area and routinely offer to help my wife when I'm deployed.

If you know that your child does well in vehicles, it's not actually a difficult thing to take them on a tour with a little bit of prep.
I will admit the original poster came across a bit strong by seeming to declare that people should leave their child at home.
Travelings easy if you start early and put a little thought into it.

I agree with beckig.i hav 2.kids and if I ever wanted to do a itt tour n was an over nighter im would not appologize to someone so rude about kids.u dont want kids thats fine but until you know and understand how to raise a family and living in anoyher counrty,i wouldnt let you have a word come out.cant control how fusy the kids are,and besides they r the ones paying for that tour as well.i woulda thought woulda been comon knlwledge to know people would bring their kids.i guess next time,go on your own.

Posted By navywife86 on 04-02-2012 4:38 AM

Posted By OKKiddo on 04-02-2012 12:32 AM

Posted By Jallen on 04-01-2012 11:30 PM
I've found that traveling with my small children has been pretty smooth, but in no way are you owed an apology. That's downright arrogant.
Whenever you subject yourself to public tours/travel in confined spaces all you can do is rant afterwards I guess. I've been stuck with sick people coughing up lungs, etc. Babies cry. Next time drive yourself.

What she said exactly!  And to suggest that a child crying indicates terrible parenting is offensive!! Babies cry.  Sometimes we can anticipate it and handle it quickly, sometimes it's something that comes out of the blue.  I'm sure the parents were doing their vary best and were unhappy with the situation as well.  Oh, and children are extremely sensitive and aware of the emotions and attitudes of those around them--they can actually read peoples faces and emotions better than any adult. It's possible that your facial expressions, attitude and behavior all contributed to the continued crying of the baby.

I agree with all of the above!  Sometimes it's difficult to find a babysitter for an all day outing such as this trip.  Having children does not have to mean that you can't go anywhere, it means you take your baby with you.  A crying baby may have irritated you, but I bet those parents were more upset by the crying.  For me, I get so embarrassed when I cannot calm my little girl.  Sometimes there just anything you can do but let them cry.  You can bet your last dollar that I would not be apologizing to you for my child, that's what young children and babies do.  They have no other way to express themselves.  Get over yourself and drive yourself next time.

^ Well said, everyone. I hope you've gotten the point by now, "Erikkicsaz"...
When I first read this post, I wasn't gonna touch it with a 20 ft pole, but this just makes me angry. I understand your need to rant, but if you do not have children & know what its like, you have no right to be posting your 'parenting advice' here. You will always be dealing with many kinds of 'annoyances' in public situations, if you don't like it, don't use public systems.
As for an apology, I wonder, are you ever asked for an apology when you're being a ****

ITT in Ikego now advises you when booking a trip that is may not be kid friendly, not good for strollers etc. You can not stop people from booking the trips unless it is specifically listed as adults only. I am not saying it is up to ITT to tell you not to bring your kids and I appreciate them trying to make it a a nicer experience for all involved. Hopefully this will help parents re-think their idea of taking young children on LONG bus trips that may not be enjoyable.

All 3 of my kids love long bus trips. They have been traveling by car since they were infants, regularly doing 12-15 hour trips to visit family when we were stateside. Everyone's situation is different and the initial post here reads as a blanket statement. Not cool.